Questions re: Abuse for the Pastors

[EvangSims]

God Bless you Pastors!

I'm curious to know how you handle abusive men or women in your churches. If a sister comes to you and says her husband is abusing her, how would you help/advise? Do you teach on this issue in your church? If so, what scriptual context do you use? How do you handle a man being abused by his wife? (Don't laugh...it happens!!)

Has a member of your congregation ever murdered another member? Husband or wife? If not, can you imagine the task set before you to minister to the congregation after an incident like that? Think about it, what would you do? Are you prepared to minister regarding domestic abuse?

Domestic abuse has become a "silent killer" in our Pentecostal Apostolic churches and I'm determine to expose this demon.

I just wanted some feedback from the Pastors.

Many blessings and peace,
Evang. Sims
www.keciasims.org (http://www.keciasims.org/)

[jesussaves4sure]

Evang. Sims,
Let me say this- Im a Pastor and I havent had it come up but, If you are a Pastor you are placed by God to protect your flock. If that means talking to this man and telling him the Truth. Report this man to the authorities and help this woman in EVERY way you can- she is going to need it!

Jesus Saves!!!!!

[Truthseeker]

God Bless you Pastors!

I'm curious to know how you handle abusive men or women in your churches. If a sister comes to you and says her husband is abusing her, how would you help/advise? Do you teach on this issue in your church? If so, what scriptual context do you use? How do you handle a man being abused by his wife? (Don't laugh...it happens!!)

Has a member of your congregation ever murdered another member? Husband or wife? If not, can you imagine the task set before you to minister to the congregation after an incident like that? Think about it, what would you do? Are you prepared to minister regarding domestic abuse?

Domestic abuse has become a "silent killer" in our Pentecostal Apostolic churches and I'm determine to expose this demon.

I just wanted some feedback from the Pastors.

Many blessings and peace,
Evang. Sims
www.keciasims.org (http://www.keciasims.org/)

I'd approach the man and give a few revelations :tup:

[EvangSims]

Bless you jesussaves4sure!

I just posed the questions to Pastors. I'm not a Pastor myself but I wanted to hear from Pastors.

I am a licensed minister and I evangelize. I am also a Certified Domestic Violence Counselor. I have been mandated by God to cry loud against this horrible issue. So I just wanted to get a feel from Pastors accross the country on how they handle this issue.

A brother in our church killed his wife last August. It was devastating!! These are people in church who I prayed with and even prayed with their daughter to receive the Holy Ghost! Then all of a sudden she's dead and he's in prison. That's when God told me to take A.C.T.I.O.N. against Domestic Violence in the church!

You can read more about A.C.T.I.O.N. on my website. But I really would love to hear from Pastors on how they deal with this issue.

Evang. Kecia
www.keciasims.org (http://www.keciasims.org)

Evang. Sims,
Let me say this- Im a Pastor and I havent had it come up but, If you are a Pastor you are placed by God to protect your flock. If that means talking to this man and telling him the Truth. Report this man to the authorities and help this woman in EVERY way you can- she is going to need it!

Jesus Saves!!!!!

[EvangSims]

Dear Bro. Rob,

So how would you deal with the wife who the man was or has abused?

Just curious.:shrug:

Evang. Kecia

I'd approach the man and give a few revelations :tup:

[ddc101]

Sister we would take her into counseling and report the abuse.We have to.Its the law.There is a womans shelter ten miles from here and also Pastor Cooper and I take folks in to live with us.We do whatever it takes.And yes I do have domestic violence training.lv sis.c

[Truthseeker]

Dear Bro. Rob,

So how would you deal with the wife who the man was or has abused?

Just curious.:shrug:

Evang. Kecia

I'm for sure know how I'd deal with the man, but the women I really can't say what I'd do. I don't know if that is something we can say how we would handle it, because every women is different with different emotional wounds from it. Plus, hearing from another man might not be the best thing at that moment.

I would hope I would be consecrated enough and sensitive to God to do the right thing for the moment. God knows when and how to give us the wisdom for these things.

[EvangSims]

That is SO good to hear!!!! I'm glad that you have the training and utilize it.

That really makes my heart glad!!!:banana: :laugh: :bow: :)


Sister we would take her into counseling and report the abuse.We have to.Its the law.There is a womans shelter ten miles from here and also Pastor Cooper and I take folks in to live with us.We do whatever it takes.And yes I do have domestic violence training.lv sis.c

[Deonna]

I'm not a pastor nor have we had to deal with issues like you've asked about (except my cousin who was abused by his wife) but we do pick up women and their children from a women's shelter every Sunday. One lady and her 3 kids have been coming faithfully to almost every service for over a couple months now. :banana:

[foxfamily238]

It's interesting to see the stats grow off the charts (when documented) of husbands, who's wives have abused them. A whole different kind of healing needs to take place. Have you encountered much of that yet? (It is known that it is much harder for men to admit abuse from their wives than vice versa)

My wife and I have encounter so many people, from youth to adults, that go through similar situations. Oh, my. The hearts and homes and families, it just weighs us down. But that's a good thing, ya know. :)

Please pray for us to continue to minister grace and the Lord's healing to sooooo many hurting families and lives. Amen..

[Deonna]

It's interesting to see the stats grow off the charts (when documented) of husbands, who's wives have abused them. A whole different kind of healing needs to take place. Have you encountered much of that yet? (It is known that it is much harder for men to admit abuse from their wives than vice versa)

That is so true. My cousin would not come out and tell us he was being abused but we saw it from the signs. He had fork wounds to his back one time and another time he ended up in the ER paralyzed because she'd kicked him in the back. The fear was all over her face because she was afraid she'd end up in jail but he made an excuse and spared her. Another way she'd abuse him was by calling the police and having him arrested on sometimes true, sometimes false charges. One time a cop told her flat out that she was the abuser because she wanted him arrested for spanking their daughter ~ the cop looked at the child and said it wasn't abuse but what she was doing was. They are divorced now.

[pastorb]

God Bless you Pastors!

I'm curious to know how you handle abusive men or women in your churches. If a sister comes to you and says her husband is abusing her, how would you help/advise? Do you teach on this issue in your church? If so, what scriptual context do you use? How do you handle a man being abused by his wife? (Don't laugh...it happens!!)

Has a member of your congregation ever murdered another member? Husband or wife? If not, can you imagine the task set before you to minister to the congregation after an incident like that? Think about it, what would you do? Are you prepared to minister regarding domestic abuse?

Domestic abuse has become a "silent killer" in our Pentecostal Apostolic churches and I'm determine to expose this demon.

I just wanted some feedback from the Pastors.

Many blessings and peace,
Evang. Sims
www.keciasims.org (http://www.keciasims.org/)

Extremely explicid questions like this should be directed to ones pastor or at the very least placed on the pastors board.

But as for me Yes I have had to minister to murderes and pray with them to receive the Holy Ghost. It's not easy to pray for a 16 year old who is doing life for killing his grandmother and having his way with his sister. It's not easy, you have to pray you have to fast and you can't let your emotions betrapped by the devil because he will use what he can when you are that close.

This is not a small question you ask so freely.

[pastorb]

Bless you jesussaves4sure!

I just posed the questions to Pastors. I'm not a Pastor myself but I wanted to hear from Pastors.

I am a licensed minister and I evangelize. I am also a Certified Domestic Violence Counselor. I have been mandated by God to cry loud against this horrible issue. So I just wanted to get a feel from Pastors accross the country on how they handle this issue.

A brother in our church killed his wife last August. It was devastating!! These are people in church who I prayed with and even prayed with their daughter to receive the Holy Ghost! Then all of a sudden she's dead and he's in prison. That's when God told me to take A.C.T.I.O.N. against Domestic Violence in the church!

You can read more about A.C.T.I.O.N. on my website. But I really would love to hear from Pastors on how they deal with this issue.

Evang. Kecia
www.keciasims.org (http://www.keciasims.org)

I have seen situations where so called saved husbands have beat as well as one situation of killing a well known bishops Daughter some years ago so I won't mention his name.

These things happen I believe because sometimes we have untrained people working with souls and people playing saved that really aren't. DA DA DA DA ain't it. You've got to speak. The Holy Ghost speaks clearly, and a saved individual lives a holy life, some fruit will follow.

But you know, if it's sweat'in, jumpin, dancin or crying we call it saved. I went to visit a friends church and sat in the back and these two young folks were up in this other kids face trying to get him to speak and the first jejejejejeje they started jumpin and shoutin he got it he got it and he didn't have nothin. I got sick. I called that brother we had to talk because thattt wasn't it.

[foxfamily238]

These things happen I believe because sometimes we have untrained people working with souls and people playing saved that really aren't. DA DA DA DA ain't it. You've got to speak. The Holy Ghost speaks clearly, and a saved individual lives a holy life, some fruit will follow.
To add to this, sometimes those we think are saved might not be! The bible is clear that we shall know them by thier fruits, not jumpin, shouting, running, or even speaking in tongues. I have lost track of the numbers of those who are FLUENT in their heavenly language, yet they do things that would make you shutter. Are they filled with the Holy Ghost? I believe so, yet we are on a journey, a race, and along the way, we...

Perfect holiness. It's a process. Being saved and living right is a process: Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God. 2nd Corinthians 7:1
So, just because we have been saved by obeying Acts 2:38, we still must learn how to walk in the Spirit. For those who have done such things, it is a matter of applying: "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. " Galatians 5:16. Yes, much more. But yet those people out there abusing their husbands and wives, must be stopped, and helped immediately. There are many cases of family, friends, and others who are directly involved, and if you have a pastor who is caring and sensative to people's needs, then get him involved. If your pastor is demanding, controlling, or insecure to the point of being biased, then seek professional help. My wife and I are Mandatory Abuse reporters, and I'm letting you know, that whether husband or wife, it must not continue. Do the "right thing"! :yeah:

:)

[pastorb]

Jeremiah said, I will give you pastors after my own heart. Because I am trained to and have dealt with this before I tell everyone. I am oblligated by law to report abuse spousel or child to the police; and any pastor that is so hard hearted that he has no compassion for the people should not be pastoring, because he is not like God.

These family secrets if you will are demonic and spiritual and I challenge every believer who knows of this to tell anyone who will listen and get help naturally so God can help you spiritually.

Don't sit there and be beat and say, "God will deliver me". He will deliver you when you have that booga arrested.


These demons have hidden in our family closets for generations and what we don't understand is that with every new seed and generation it's gets worse and worse.

Men hit women because they have been hit and didn't know how to fight back so this is where they get their self esteem and validation, in control, even with sexual sins of men and women it's about power and control. For some who don't know what real love is replace it with satisfying the senses anyway they can with brother, father, mother, friend or whoever will let them, it's an evil thirst that can never be quinched until theyare delivered and saved.

I prayed with a young lady right before I was going to baptize her and as I prayed she prayed and I simply said open up your mouth and pray and she began to forgive her mother who knew her father was abusing her, she forgave her brothers for molesting her and until then she was loose when we met her but she was trying, and when she finished forgiving all those who hurt her she took a deep breath and began to speak in tongues for about 20 minutes. I baptized this sister in water in Jesus name and she is free, she stopped having anxiety attacks and everything.

The problem is we just want to shout and be saved not everybody wants to work. God has blessed us we have a good size church but it's not big, I know everyone by name and they know me and my wife, we can help people without an appointment. I don't believe God called a few people to pastor the nation. Jakes, Parsley, Dollar, Ellis; 20 thousand members, they don't know those people and are so far detatched from them and if they tried to see them it would take weeks or months. They can't effectively pastor the nation.

We have to become more pro-active in ministry and step out the pulpit.

[hna_diana]

Well, let's see. The first minister I went to when my preacher husband was abusive told me that it was my fault because I refused to say "for better or for worse" when we exchanged our wedding vows. I had been willing to say, "no matter what joys and trials we face together", but the minister thought there was some kind of magic in the traditional wedding vows, and somehow I must have broken the spell. (Have you ever looked to see who wrote those vows?)

The second minister confessed to me that he had some kind of mental problem that caused him to give up his church in another city. After he found out what was wrong with him he got on medication that he will have to take for the rest of his life, and began pastoring again. At first he was supportive, but when his counseling of our marriage didn't have success, he started to get frustrated with me. He finally housed my husband after the second abandonment. The pastor insisted that "no man has to be afraid that his wife will put him in jail." Yes, my husband was afraid that his uncontrollable rage would cause him to put me in the hospital or the morgue, and the authorities would put him away. So he fled the home instead.

The third minister tried to work with us for a while. He would counsel us in his office, and my husband would be so calm. As soon as we were back in the car, his rage would erupt again. That minister told me that he believed everything my husband said because my husband was so calm, and he believed nothing I said because I was so upset. He also said that he believes that the person who complains is the one who is causing the problem. Since my husband wasn't complaining about the marriage, he must not be part of the problem. After the third and final abandonment, this minister told me "I don't believe in domestic violence" and his wife told me "if you had stayed together and he had killed you, it would have been God's will." I should have filed suit against these people. They are still UPC ministers as far as I know.

By the way, if you asked my ex-, he would say that he was the abused party and I was just making it all up. Abusers have such messed up mind, they FEEL controlled when a normal person sets boundaries and won't let them cross. They FEEL abused when a normal person steps away from their abuse. They FEEL offended by their vivid imaginations that create attacks and slights by other who could never have dreamed that their normal actions would be interpreted in such a way. (For instance, if their victim offers them a drink of water, they may imagine that the victim is going to poison them.)

One of the books I read when I was trying to escape was co-authored by Nicole Brown Simpson's father, by her minister, and by a couple others (but I can't remember the name!) The minister admitted that seeking help from the church seldom produces any positive results. Hopefully things have changed over the last 10 years.

God bless those of you who are working to identify and eliminate this problem, especially from apostolic churches.

Sis. Diane

[Deonna]

After the third and final abandonment, this minister told me "I don't believe in domestic violence" and his wife told me "if you had stayed together and he had killed you, it would have been God's will." I should have filed suit against these people. They are still UPC ministers as far as I know.

I'm sorry to hear of your abuse ~ NO ONE should be abused no matter how the other perceives that the other is acting whether real or imagined. *Shock* is my reaction to their words ~ especially the min's wife. Some people are just ....*grrrrrr!*

No, you did the right thing biblically by not filing suit on them ~ the bible says not to take a brother to court....take them to Jesus. Let the LORD fight your battle. They were by all means wrong in what they said but the Bible gives us instruction on how we should handle being wronged. Did you take it to the Superintendant of the state?

[hna_diana]

Did you take it to the Superintendant of the state?I have already seen how the UPC handles accusations against pastors. The pastor is ALWAYS right, unless there is a mountain of undeniable evidence and a multitude of eyewitnesses who are willing to testify against him. Regardless of the outcome, the complaining saint gets blackballed by the organization. I have heard directly from pastors of how these poor 'troublemaking saints' are gossipped about and plotted against at district 'pastors'' meetings.

I have a friend whose best friend was having an affair with a pastor. They met frequently in his home while his wife was gone to work and her husband was gone to work. They shared intimicies that should only be shared between husband and wife, but they did not actually have sexual intercourse. This was a terrible tangled mess. The lady involved in the affair had a wacked out perverted husband who was struggling with traumas he had experienced in his own life. The lady had been asking the pastor for help with her marital situation. Meanwhile, the pastor and his wife were iin a childless, and perhaps loveless relationship. The pastor and the saint fell into the trap of trying to be comforting while trying to keep a thin line of legality to be able to deny culpability.

The poor lady was eventually so guilt-ridden that she couldn't handle it and she confessed to her husband and her best friend. Wouldn't you know it, when they all confronted the pastor and tried to take it to the higher-ups they were told that there wasn't any evidence! It was her word against his, and they were going to stand by the long-time pastor instead of the lady in the stormy marriage.

Maybe other districts don't have the same problems, but this district is overwhelmed with hypocricy, pride and arrogance, favoritism and bias, stubbornness, unforgiveness, and abuse of authority. I have no doubt that if I had taken my situation to the church authorities, the UPC would have made it their business to destroy me instead of trying to get to the truth of the matter and generate restoration, reconciliation, and salvation.

I once lived and open, carefree life, never dreaming that the people who claimed to be bringing me the message of salvation would be the ones who worked the hardest to devastate me. My life will never be the same. The abuses of the 'church' have forced me to be wary, suspicious and skeptical. My trust, honesty and sincerity were rewarded with deep personal attacks.

I should have taken them to the authorities, my dear sister, just as I should have had my then-husband jailed. We are not supposed to take our brethren to the law because we (Christians) have a higher authority and a higher standard: The Lord Jesus Christ is our authority and the Bible is our standard. These people did not respect, and would not respond to the authority of God. Therefore, their unlawful actions should have been taken to the legal system.

I can be grateful now, and I can see how GOD has removed me from the organization and structure of a church that has fallen away from truth. GOD has led me to other true believers who do not depend on tradition, fad, or favoritism, but depend wholly on the one and only living GOD.

PRAISE HIS HOLY NAME!

Sis. D